Super heavies coming to a 40k table near you!!!!

[PhoenixFire]

I think this bigger, more expensive model stuff has to stop.  I have no interest $160 models, I don't even have an interest in $115 models, for that matter.

Moreover, bigger models get kinda dumb.  I'm starting to feel like we're playing with tonka trucks here.

It makes sense from a business perspective that GW making these new expansions allowing use of the big kits and new fortifications in normal games because i seriously doubt they are currently flying off the shelves.

I'd love to be able to use my IG super heavies a lot more than once a year, it even makes perfect sense from a fluff perspective. But your right $160 is ridiculous, hell when i bought my first couple baneblades they were $80ish and now they're $140

[andalucien]

I'm kinda more in the "bigger is better" camp...   But I have zero confidence in GW's ability to successfully make the rules work here.

[robpro]

Some of us will just be happy to finally get in game 2 with that Pylon they bought 4 years ago...

[Sir_Prometheus]

A lot of the hobby inclined like the look of big models.  But where does it go from a game perspective?  Am I the only one who thinks it's sill when we have these huge oval bases everywhere, that are literally half the range of a 12" gun? 

[andalucien]

Yeah that does start to make the silly look sillier... really the scale was already way off though.  Look, my scout sniper rifles can hit a target 36" away! (which if you multiply out the 1/72 scale of 40k is, um, 200 feet).  I guess marksmanship is among the skills that has taken a step backwards as civilization collapses in the 41st millenium...

[robpro]

To some degree I like it. Big models make for cooler battles, especially with more narrative or tiered missions. If you didimits like they have in fantasy (say no more than 25% of your points on a super heavy), you wouldn't see thr really dumb ones unless the game was huge. The ones under 500 points are somewhat balanced and eat up more points in your army than their usefulness likely adds.

[MM3791]

I'd like to point out that having a 2500 pt+, double FOC tourney/game is just one step away from apocalypse. 

[Sir_Prometheus]

I'd like to point out that super-heavies (and more to the point, destroyer weapons), stratagems and formations make a huge freaking difference.

[MM3791]

I'd like to point out that super-heavies (and more to the point, destroyer weapons), stratagems and formations make a huge freaking difference.

I'm not so sure when you already have people playing with a double FOC, when people are already fielding 6 riptides/wraithknights etc.

[Sir_Prometheus]

Uh...look, people fear double FOC because they think spamming riptides, or whatever it is you fear is the way to win things.  It's not, you can take 5 Riptides now, if you really want to, and it's not that great (the O'vesa star is a very different thing, manipulating LoS! and unit buffs).  I only use one, and I do pretty well. 

You can take 9 vendettas now, if you want, people don't, and taking 18 isn't any better. 

[MM3791]

I'm saying in terms of game size and unit flexabilty, its not that far off.

[robpro]

It's a function of scale. Running a Reaver Titan in a 2k or 2500 game is insane, but in a 5k or 10k it won't be especially significant. I think most super heavies clicking in around 500 or fewer points wouldnt be too awful to see in a 2k or 2500 game.

What would be too busted if you put a limit of no more than 25% of your points can be spent on super heavies in a 2500 point game, and also say your opponent gets an extra mission point if they kill your super heavy?

[Sir_Prometheus]

I'm not too familiar with the current Apoc rules - I have the book through methods but haven't even been able to summon the interest to read, but still, I gather the problem isn't super-heavies -- I hear they die about as fast as anything else to melta weapons so much as sdestroyer weapons.  Last I looked, destroyer weapons are really meant to literally make you take whole fist fulls of models of table at a time.  (which is the only way a full Apoc game even gets to end at a reasonable time)

[robpro]

You can't really get more than one d weapon on a super heavy until you start paying 750+ points for the model, I think something shooting one d weapon (even if its a 5 or 7 inch blast) won't break the bank.

[PhoenixFire]

Super heavies got super awesome in the new book, ignoring 5/6ths of the damage table.

A solid D str hit on a super heavy will still ruin it's day. As to what has D weapons (not counting titans)

of the 8 or 9 variants of a Baneblade only one has a D weapon and it's only the size of a large blast.

New necron has a D str apoc template (which is terrifying)

CSM walker thing has a D str close combat weapon

Stompa has something D i think

as to Matts point, yes Melta will still put a hurting on them and the quickest way to kill a super heavy is get some str 10 close combat on it and those 9 hull points will disappear fast