Plainville vs. Abington: Tournament Frequency

[SyRael]

I am sorry, but it is a rare day that I can make that drive over to the PV store. Honestly, I agree that we here in AB do have a diffrent feel to us, but we like playing and love events. Just look at the last 500pts game played. It really was a good time. I have noticed  that we tend to play events that are not straight foward one on one death matches. But we do run events like 10 man king of the hill, 750pt seek and find, and three on three capture the flag type games that are never sponsored by the store. That stuff gets us going. To say that PV wants it more than us because they like compition for compition sake is just plain wrong. I want a reason to spend money at Derek's store,  but if the game I play has really no events, then I'm either not playing or on the floor at someone's house. AB has player like myself who have been coming to AB for over ten years and want  to keep coming back. I love it here, and will never feel that passion for a store well over a hour away from where I live. I and do agree that  the issue about  terrain  can be sovled easily. Split it. PV can use less, give AB bare bones for now. A lot of us worked on that stuff before there even was another store.  I'm really getting heated about this, so I'm done.

With deep respect,
Thank you.

[Mad Dok Rob]

please note the smiley I used I was joking

But there's no smiley after that statement. Does that mean shit just got real?

[Seth]

1250 doubles

[Grand Master Steve]

I am sorry, but it is a rare day that I can make that drive over to the PV store. Honestly, I agree that we here in AB do have a diffrent feel to us, but we like playing and love events. Just look at the last 500pts game played. It really was a good time. I have noticed  that we tend to play events that are not straight foward one on one death matches. But we do run events like 10 man king of the hill, 750pt seek and find, and three on three capture the flag type games that are never sponsored by the store. That stuff gets us going. To say that PV wants it more than us because they like compition for compition sake is just plain wrong. I want a reason to spend money at Derek's store,  but if the game I play has really no events, then I'm either not playing or on the floor at someone's house. AB has player like myself who have been coming to AB for over ten years and want  to keep coming back. I love it here, and will never feel that passion for a store well over a hour away from where I live. I and do agree that  the issue about  terrain  can be sovled easily. Split it. PV can use less, give AB bare bones for now. A lot of us worked on that stuff before there even was another store.  I'm really getting heated about this, so I'm done.

With deep respect,
Thank you.

I agree with a lot of what is said here. I feel ever since PV came into the fold, AB has been over looked sneezed at and tossed aside. Terrain always seems to be an issue and when it comes back to AB its always in worse condition then it was before it was sent out.

Any way enough of that, I just want to see a small point tourney or a small point doubles, something anything. Throw us a bone here!

[Chase]

So this really boils down to a few of key things that are probably not obvious.


1) Battleground currently doesn't have enough decent terrain to put together 15+ tables at each location. 

Here's some insight into how this has worked up until recently:

Chase:  Derek, my 40k event is coming up this weekend.  I'm going to need something like 5 or 6 tables and all of the buildings, ruins, and other 40k terrain you've got over there.  [Pro Tip:  Having a lot more terrain than you need speeds up the "set up" phase considerably.]

Chase:  Derek, my 40k event is tomorrow.  Will you have a chance to get some stuff down here?  I need enough stuff for like 17 tables total.

Derek:  Hey dude, I'll be coming down sometime tomorrow night.  Is that going to be alright?

Chase:  Yeah.  I'd love it here ASAP but tomorrow night is okay.  I'm going to be here until 3 or 4am anyways.

(So sometime Friday night, in the midst of 30-60 Magic players signing up for, buying cards for, and playing in Friday Night Magic Derek, needs to find a bunch of 40k terrain and a few tables, consolidate them, pack them up, load his truck, and drive down here to unload it all, sometimes help set up, and then drive home.)

After the event it works something like this:

Derek:  So we'll have to get some of the terrain back here for Thursday night.

Chase:  Okay, cool.  Are you, Lisa, or Beth going to be able to come pick it up or am I bringing it back?

Derek:  I'm not sure, we'll figure something out.

(At some point before Thursday I need to find stuff, consolidate it, pack it up, and set it aside or load it into my car and drive it back to Abington.)

Moral of this story:  HAVING TO DO THIS ONCE OR TWICE A MONTH BLOWS!  It's a giant chore that at least 3 people (excluding Caden, Derek's 4 year old) have to plan half a day around.  Also, terrain gets damaged in transit.  Shocking, I know.


2) The amount of behind the scenes work that goes into running a 40k event is not small.

Between keeping an accurate roster, chasing people down for their lists, checking the lists, getting in touch with people who have sent incorrect lists, making sure the new lists are correct, dropping people, adding people, creating / stealing the scenarios, editing the scenarios, going back and forth getting the packet created, and making sure the tables and terrain are all squared away, a lot of time and energy goes into things.  This is something that the Plainville staff does exclusively (Lisa puts together the packet in photoshop).  If the Abington staff would like to take it on for their own events, it would make things considerably more manageable and a lot easier when it comes to hosting events there with more frequency.  I'm not saying the Plainville staff won't continue to do it, however.

I know this may come as a surprise, but we're busy people before events get factored in.  Also, I know it's easy to forget but we've got stuff going on for a few other game systems too. 

There's a couple more logistical "problems" involved with the Plainville staff working on Abington events, but they're beyond the scope of this.  We hope that in the future this will be less of an issue.


3)  I'm reasonably sure that hosting regular tournaments in Abington is not an ideal fit for that community.

It's common knowledge that the two communities are pretty different.  Non-tournament events are much better suited to Abington.  Tournament attendance numbers over all miniature games are indicative of this fact and have remained the same over the 3 years Plainville has been open.

This is not to say that non-tournament events don't and wouldn't do well in Plainville, it's just my opinion that they're a much better fit for the Abington community vs. the "competitive" environment that's associated with tournaments.  Of course we still run into the problems that number 2 presents, like designing and actually running the non-tournament events over there, but solutions have already presented themselves.

It seems to me like people didn't read this.  I guess I'll paraphrase:


1) We don't have enough terrain to support the types of TOURNAMENTS we'd like without moving tables and terrain back and forth.

- We've taken steps to change this situation this summer. Paul built 30+ gorgeous buildings for Abington.  They are the best the store has ever had.  Abington current;y has a TON of awesome 40k terrain.

- There's a massive project in the planning phases that will change this completely.  I really hopes it comes to be.

- Tables and terrain get damaged in transit and by heavy use.


2) Organizing and executing a 40k event is a lot of work.

- The Plainville staff / community is entirely responsible for the back end of all 40k tournaments and some small events BG has run over the last 3 years.

- The Plainville staff is a resource that I must allocate to the best of my ability.  We've got lots of work we have to do here to keep business running as usual.  Just like a real, live, big kid business we feel pressured to "do better" than we did the previous year.  This means improving our product, schedule, and service.  When there's time for extras, I tend to focus the staff on their home base.  Can we at least agree that this makes sense?

- I am out of touch with what the Abington community would like.

- We recognize that it's been a while (May) in between an Abington 40k tournament / event of some sort.  We will get one (or a couple small "TANKSgiving" type events) in before the end of the year.  We had an event lined up for Abington this summer but a 10 week league began, so we didn't execute it.


3) I'm not sure tournaments are where it's at for the Abington 40k scene.

- See Ian's post.

- See Brandon's post (SyRael).

- See tournament attendance in both locations over the past year.

- Communicate interests to me or the Abington staff.

- There's nothing preventing the community from organizing an informal (or formal, see the last 4-5 WM tournaments or leagues) event of any kind.

- Let's collaborate.

- Stuff is coming.

- I'd feel better if I heard from more than 4 or 5 Abington guys about this. 


I may be wrong, but I'd like to think Battleground as a business provides more options and opportunities for it's community to play 40k than anywhere else in the region.  I feel sort of slighted that despite this fact some of you are upset about that lack of events.  I put a lot of time into 40k stuff, certainly have in the past, and will continue to in the future.  It would be cool to hear about people's issues and how "pissed" they are before posts on our message board that are seemingly out of nowhere.

I'm pretty much the most accessible person I can possibly be.  Communicate please.

[Chase]

If Steve D is trolling me, he's doing a damn good job of it...

[MM3791]

Battlegrounds owns Massachusetts in terms of gaming support and events. Like, legit for real. Other clubs in the area don't run 40k tournaments every month, and some don't even have a dedicated website, just facebook pages.

I think the BG staff does an outstanding job at running events. I personally only play GW games but they also do a great job with Magic, Warmachine, and basically whatever other game is thrown at them.

This summer we even had a really great 40k campaign that actually strengthened the 40k community because it gave gamers a chance to meet other gamers in the area.

BG even has annual megabattles where the staff rents out a hall to play 40k Apocalypse. 

BG caters to casual and competitive gamers all year round, so I really can't see why anyone would have a problem with support for events. In my experience as long as their is a demand for a particular gaming event, BG will meet and execute it in an efficient manner.

This is just my experience, I've been coming to Battlegrounds on and off since 2004.. this is actually the most active I've ever been in the wargaming scene, mostly due to the 40k campaign. I look forward to future events and campaigns @ BG.

[Benjamin]

It seems Abington needs a dedicated 40k employee, because I couldn't tell you who it is.

[the_trooper]

It seems Abington needs a dedicated 40k employee, because I couldn't tell you who it is.

Are you saying that Cale should wine and dine you to convince you to move to Abington?

[Benjamin]

Are you saying that Cale should wine and dine you to convince you to move to Abington?

Flattering, but Plainville's my home and it's lowly skeleton crew like family. It probably takes that level of devotion to do whatever it is I do, and there's certainly no emotional motivation lacking in this thread.

[SyRael]

Battlegrounds owns Massachusetts in terms of gaming support and events. Like, legit for real. Other clubs in the area don't run 40k tournaments every month, and some don't even have a dedicated website, just facebook pages.

I think the BG staff does an outstanding job at running events. I personally only play GW games but they also do a great job with Magic, Warmachine, and basically whatever other game is thrown at them.

This summer we even had a really great 40k campaign that actually strengthened the 40k community because it gave gamers a chance to meet other gamers in the area.

BG even has annual megabattles where the staff rents out a hall to play 40k Apocalypse. 

BG caters to casual and competitive gamers all year round, so I really can't see why anyone would have a problem with support for events. In my experience as long as their is a demand for a particular gaming event, BG will meet and execute it in an efficient manner.

This is just my experience, I've been coming to Battlegrounds on and off since 2004.. this is actually the most active I've ever been in the wargaming scene, mostly due to the 40k campaign. I look forward to future events and campaigns @ BG.

I completly agree. Chase we love what tis store does for us and never has been our focus to imply otherwise. I like you thoughts also. I understand that both stores must bring it together so that we NEVER create a  "us-them" situation between the two stores.  I think the heart of the issue is that Friday night is among the best time for most of us to meet and play, but that night is for Magic and can never not be for Magic (the store needs to make money and has other people who play other games). I work like most people and showing up on a weekday nightafter 5 to play a 4 hr game is hard. I know this to be true for most of us. AB has the player base, but the space/time is an issue. Try Sat? We have and at times some of us can work out the time off. This is not an issue of the store's, rather one of those times the real life Fs it all up. There is not enough space on Friday nights, nor should we ask for it (If Derek does not make is money then there is no store). The issue about the warhammer stuff has become silly. Chase I trust that the staff does whatever is in thier power to do thier best and I think we all understand that shit breaks. I regule my destoryer arms before every game. And yes, I think it would be ideal to get a store employee to oversee warhammer in AB. The only issue that is getting us upset is way wording is being used, not by the store staff (I think). AB has shown over tens year of dedication to the events held at Battlegrounds and for some to imply that we are otherwise due to a diffrent gaming philosophy that is a bit more causal is ridiculous. With that said, I see this issue more as "Hey Chase this is what we need/ would like to do" and us helping him out. Chase I think you take the heat to much (but in away like it), and I just want you to understand that in no way are you this time at fault.

[Thomas callahan]

I may be wrong, but I'd like to think Battleground as a business provides more options and opportunities for it's community to play 40k than anywhere else in the region.  I feel sort of slighted that despite this fact some of you are upset about that lack of events.  I put a lot of time into 40k stuff, certainly have in the past, and will continue to in the future.  It would be cool to hear about people's issues and how "pissed" they are before posts on our message board that are seemingly out of nowhere.

I'm pretty much the most accessible person I can possibly be.  Communicate please.
[/quote]

I think the reason why its all blowing up now seemingly out of nowhere is because everyone in abington has been dealing with for awhile. We complained to each other but never to you, D or anyone else because we respect you guys and know you do alot for use and have a ton of work to do. But it all just built up over the months and now this thread happens and people are finaly letting loose on what has been on their minds.

Besides, we are not pissed, just annoyed. If we were pissed, this whole thread would turn out much more ugly

[keithb]

Honestly, The best thing abington people can do to get more tournaments, is to 1) talk to derek/chase, etc... about it. 2) show up to plainville events.

I can't tell you how many times I've heard chase mubble about wishing more of the Abington people show up to events.  I am sure that all

Also, note that I said SHOW up to events, Signing up and then not Showing up is about the worst because it makes all of the abington people(assuming it is abington people who do this) look like flakes.  Don't reflect badly on your community!

I makes no business sense to move an event FROM where all the attendees are.  I would love to have more events at abington if more abington people would show up to events there AND at plainville.

[PhoenixFire]

Honestly, The best thing abington people can do to get more tournaments, is to 1) talk to derek/chase, etc... about it. 2) show up to plainville events.

I can't tell you how many times I've heard chase mubble about wishing more of the Abington people show up to events.  I am sure that all

Also, note that I said SHOW up to events, Signing up and then not Showing up is about the worst because it makes all of the abington people(assuming it is abington people who do this) look like flakes.  Don't reflect badly on your community!

I makes no business sense to move an event FROM where all the attendees are.  I would love to have more events at abington if more abington people would show up to events there AND at plainville.

+1

[Grand Master Steve]

Honestly, The best thing abington people can do to get more tournaments, is to 1) talk to derek/chase, etc... about it. 2) show up to plainville events.

I can't tell you how many times I've heard chase mubble about wishing more of the Abington people show up to events.  I am sure that all

Also, note that I said SHOW up to events, Signing up and then not Showing up is about the worst because it makes all of the abington people(assuming it is abington people who do this) look like flakes.  Don't reflect badly on your community!

I makes no business sense to move an event FROM where all the attendees are.  I would love to have more events at abington if more abington people would show up to events there AND at plainville.

well there in lies the largest problem. PV is to much of a hike for some of us at early morning hours. I know I will be falling asleep behind the wheel. Whene ver I have singed up I show up so I dont know who else sings up from Abington and is a no show. I think we need to actualy utalize the new space in Abington and hold tournaments even small ones.