6th Edition Experiences

[Bill]

Just curious on people's experience so far with 6th edition. Thoughts, ideas, lists, whatever you want. Please no rants on OMG this is broken it is just far too early for rants on anything.

So this is what I have been testing. Have three games under my belt as the moment and so far very happy with most of the rules so far and I feel like my precious daemons SHOULD be ok to play but overall lost quite a bit of power but not taking fearless wounds is going a long way.

CSM w/ Daemon Detachment: Single Force Org
CSM:
Daemon Prince: MoS, Wings, Sorcerer, Lash of Submission
Daemon Prince: MoS, Wings, Sorcerer, Lash of Submission
7 Plague Marines: Personal Icon, 2x Plasma Guns
7 Plague Marines: Personal Icon, 2x Plasma Guns
5 Plague Marines: Personal Icon, 2x Plasma Guns
2 Obliterators
2 Obliterators

Daemons:
Bloodthirster: Blessing of the Blood God, Unholy Might
8 Blood Crushers
9 Nurglings
8 Screamers of Tzeentch

The only underachiever in each game so far has been the bloodcrusher. Losing the closest model for that unit with the base size is just crippling, every model that dies moves the unit back 3" so the issue may just be how I am using the unit. I might try flamers but I am having trouble paying 35 points per model when crushers are 40 but flamers put a hurting on terminators which is what this list needs.

[the_trooper]

So, the icons work for the daemons, right?

Weird to see lash of submission back but the fear of vehicles plays right into your hands.

[Benjamin]

Craziest change for me was how quickly my Thunderhammers smashed a Land Raider. 4 glances, don't even to roll damage. Four 6's and wrecked! Hull points just hurt vehicles so much, or at least it seems so to me. I would always rolls those 1s and 2s on the vehicle damage chart and have it mean nothing; now I'm winning!

Not taking No Retreat! wounds is a wild thing.

[GossWeapon]

Bill,

After playtesting a few games and watching a few, I think that demons will be fine, but I think the route to go is banking on lash/pavane and flying MCs.  I had a similar list, but in reverse heres a rough idea of what was going on for 2,000 points:

HQ
The masque
Tzeentch chariot w/ the works

Fateweaver

troops
5 horrors w/ bolt x6

heavy
3x tzeentch princes - fully loaded



CSM detatchment
lash prince

chosen x5 w/ meltagun x5

PM x5 w/ 2 melta + combi melta + powerfist
PM x5 w/ 2 melta + combi melta + powerfist

havocs x5 w/ meltagun x4


My thought process: MCs with wings are too legit too quit.  pavane x3 is sooooo good because I get to pull what I want closer and push the rest back, but on three units.  Lash helps with what you realised (the loss of ground to new allocation) and pins something (maybe).  We were unsure of whether detatchments followed codex rules or not so for now we have been playing that the csm go in the waves (makes sense fluff wise).  Everything worked well, other than the pink horrors, which were hit/miss.  One game I dropped a few upgrades to get a landing pad, but it didn't seem all that effective...  Personally I think flying MCs will dominate the meta.  one game vs mech BA was awesome, vehicles either really do suck, or I am just the melta master.  For now I am going to go with I am the melta master.  Swooping wizards kick ass.

Hope that helps

[Grand Master Steve]

Seems once again Khorne MCs get the shaft.

[Sir_Prometheus]

Personally, the whole flying thing is starting to bother me.  To hard to fight. 

[Bill]

Seems once again Khorne MCs get the shaft.

Str 8 Vector Strikes are the bees knees IMO.

[Bill]

Bill,

After playtesting a few games and watching a few, I think that demons will be fine, but I think the route to go is banking on lash/pavane and flying MCs.  I had a similar list, but in reverse heres a rough idea of what was going on for 2,000 points:

HQ
The masque
Tzeentch chariot w/ the works

Fateweaver

troops
5 horrors w/ bolt x6

heavy
3x tzeentch princes - fully loaded



CSM detatchment
lash prince

chosen x5 w/ meltagun x5

PM x5 w/ 2 melta + combi melta + powerfist
PM x5 w/ 2 melta + combi melta + powerfist

havocs x5 w/ meltagun x4


My thought process: MCs with wings are too legit too quit.  pavane x3 is sooooo good because I get to pull what I want closer and push the rest back, but on three units.  Lash helps with what you realised (the loss of ground to new allocation) and pins something (maybe).  We were unsure of whether detatchments followed codex rules or not so for now we have been playing that the csm go in the waves (makes sense fluff wise).  Everything worked well, other than the pink horrors, which were hit/miss.  One game I dropped a few upgrades to get a landing pad, but it didn't seem all that effective...  Personally I think flying MCs will dominate the meta.  one game vs mech BA was awesome, vehicles either really do suck, or I am just the melta master.  For now I am going to go with I am the melta master.  Swooping wizards kick ass.

Hope that helps

I agree with everything you have here I eventually want to do a mix between what you have and what I am running, so far my build is working and unless I start seeing like 4-5 fliers I should be ok with what I have for now. I have alot of work to do before NOVA, I know that.

[andalucien]

Yeah I made up a Daemons list with a CSM lash prince allied in as well... Lash & Pavane do seem ridiculously powerful, if one goes off it becomes very easy to then snipe all of the combat/special weapons out of the squad.   

I guess deny the witch does make it a little more fair though.... even against a squad with no specific psychic defense, first you have to pass your psychic test, then you have to hit with the shot, then they have to fail Deny the Witch.

[andalucien]

Sooo.... if you take a mixed Daemon + CSM army, it seems rather ambiguous whether the Daemons from the Daemon codex are allowed to use Personal Icons from the Chaos Space Marine codex.   Although from a fluff perspective, they're the same thing, they do have 2 different names, and RAW, a Daemon would certainly not be able to use a Personal Icon.

Here's a quote from the CSM codex:  "Note that Icons only work for models In Terminator Armour, Obliterators and Lesser Daemons".

[Grand Master Steve]

oh did I mis-read? A Blood Thirster can do vector strikes? I thought they can only perform shooting attacks?

[andalucien]

Hmm,

It seems that CSM Daemons Princes are "Jump Monstrous Creatures", not "Flying Monstrous Creatures".   That seems huge, amiright Bill?  Still haven't gotten a game in

Just from theoryhammer, it would seem that the core rules SHOULD have given Daemons a huge boost...

1) No such thing as fearless wounds anymore.   
2) Reserves come in on a 3+, 3+, automatic now. 
3) Deep strike mishaps are nowhere near as bad as they used to be. 
4) It's very easy to hit enemy vehicles in assault now.

In my experience in 5th, those were 4 of the biggest problems that Daemons had to deal with, and they all either went away or got way less problematic.   

[Benjamin]

Sooo.... if you take a mixed Daemon + CSM army, it seems rather ambiguous whether the Daemons from the Daemon codex are allowed to use Personal Icons from the Chaos Space Marine codex.   Although from a fluff perspective, they're the same thing, they do have 2 different names, and RAW, a Daemon would certainly not be able to use a Personal Icon.

There's no ambiguity. Two different things are two different things. You really cannot listen to the voice that says, "But it makes fluff sense!" There are neither Lesser Daemons nor Greater Daemons in the CD codex, so there are no units from the CD codex that can use CSM icons.

Now... I don't have my CD codex in front of me, seems to have gone missing. But if I remember the wording correctly, all friendly units can use CD Icons. So if I'm remembering that part correctly, I believe CSM units like Terminators and Oblits as Battle Brothers would be able to use Chaos Daemon Icons.

[MM3791]

Personally, the whole flying thing is starting to bother me.  To hard to fight.

Post your army list so we can help you.

[Ian Mulligan]

Ben, you're dead on with the Chaos Daemons icons.