[Plainville MA] Battleground 40k Doubles Tournament - 12/3

[Chase]

I think the issue is being able to multi-assault several (armored) things first turn, before they can do anything about it, rendering many things "useless", with a unit that is largely comprised of "free" models.

There is no doubt it's extremely powerful and that the "conga line" was not intended.  Definitely an oversite by the author, but it looks like we're playing it RAW this weekend.  Sam is our rules guy, and I think we can unanimously agree that he's very good at it.


Again, I do not foresee this being an issue on Saturday.

[Benjamin]

Sam and I chatted about this tonight for awhile, and I feel better after talking with him. He understands the concerns on all sides, and I support him fully on the issue. There's no right answer and no way to make everyone happy. We think we know what the rules were supposed to mean, but RAW is ultimately the better choice.

I do think there's some over-reaction. Scarabs wrecking a bunch of vehicles first turn, the outcome is the same as so many other armies, like IG, Space Wolves, Blood Angels... You're losing alot of your vehicles to any good army. Instead of in the Shooting Phase, it's now the Assault Phase. Same shit, different shovel.

As a player, just be ready for it. Just remember too, they're only T3 and they don't have Eternal Warrior. They'll present a very different challenge, but we're all smart enough to figure it out. Just have to do it faster!

[keithb]

Sounds great sam.  

Also, you weren't just being asked how you read the rule but also if it should be legal.

You've played 40k, does a 50" assault seem like it was designed to happen, or just stupid oversight?

Sam is the TO and I'm sure hes read the thread. He's a really smart dude and wouldn't randomly come to his conclusion. I'm sure that's how he landed the TO spot in the first place. Rather than see this thread degenerate into trying to change his mind, it would be better to accept what the organizer has decided and move on. If it happens, it happens.

My response was simply because there was more than one question in play here, and sam only addressed one of them.  A TO isn't hamstrung by exact wording in one army codex unless they want to be.  I totally support it being Sam's decision, I just wanted to be sure that he considered more than just the text on the page.

[keithb]

Sam and I chatted about this tonight for awhile, and I feel better after talking with him. He understands the concerns on all sides, and I support him fully on the issue. There's no right answer and no way to make everyone happy. We think we know what the rules were supposed to mean, but RAW is ultimately the better choice.

I do think there's some over-reaction. Scarabs wrecking a bunch of vehicles first turn, the outcome is the same as so many other armies, like IG, Space Wolves, Blood Angels... You're losing alot of your vehicles to any good army. Instead of in the Shooting Phase, it's now the Assault Phase. Same shit, different shovel.

As a player, just be ready for it. Just remember too, they're only T3 and they don't have Eternal Warrior. They'll present a very different challenge, but we're all smart enough to figure it out. Just have to do it faster!

It isn't even about the potential for the first turn carnage.  Though, it is easier to set up to get cover saves from shooting than hide from scarabs on BG tables.

The bigger concern is just the 50" threat range, which is more than twice ANY OTHER UNIT in the game.   It's absurd and clearly an oversight.

[Alley Livingston]

I know it's kind of late to ask but my ride home bailed and I was wondering if I could get a ride home from someone, I can give gas money plus some. I live in braintree.

[Chase]

Cookie and Capone are supposed to be playing, Alley.  I would ask them.

[Benjamin]

The bigger concern is just the 50" threat range, which is more than twice ANY OTHER UNIT in the game.   It's absurd and clearly an oversight.

After the Death Ray "models in the unit under the line" conversation on this forum, only one thing is clear to me. We can't know with any certainty what GW intended at any given moment. This is especially true with 6th Edition on the horizon, as they're writing with tilt toward a game balance that we don't even know exists.

If and when GW and/or INAT defines/clarifies the rules, BG will keep pace.

[Alley Livingston]

Cookie and Capone are supposed to be playing, Alley.  I would ask them.

they are but arw driving together in Capone's truck so no room

[Ian Mulligan]

The bigger concern is just the 50" threat range, which is more than twice ANY OTHER UNIT in the game.   It's absurd and clearly an oversight.

After the Death Ray "models in the unit under the line" conversation on this forum, only one thing is clear to me. We can't know with any certainty what GW intended at any given moment. This is especially true with 6th Edition on the horizon, as they're writing with tilt toward a game balance that we don't even know exists.

If and when GW and/or INAT defines/clarifies the rules, BG will keep pace.

This. This. A thousand times this.

[keithb]

My biggest problem is that we can't with any certainty assume GW knows what it intended at any given moment.   They are simply a "Model company" after all.

Makes me wonder why I bothered painting my Tyranids first when I have a whole Circle of Orboros Army that has been waiting patiently for years at this point. 

[Seth]

because tyranids don't have tanks so they are safe. you are fine don't worry about the scarabs then.

[Ian Mulligan]

because tyranids don't have tanks so they are safe. you are fine don't worry about the scarabs then.

I legit lol'd in class.

[Sir_Prometheus]

The bigger concern is just the 50" threat range, which is more than twice ANY OTHER UNIT in the game.   It's absurd and clearly an oversight.

After the Death Ray "models in the unit under the line" conversation on this forum, only one thing is clear to me. We can't know with any certainty what GW intended at any given moment. This is especially true with 6th Edition on the horizon, as they're writing with tilt toward a game balance that we don't even know exists.

If and when GW and/or INAT defines/clarifies the rules, BG will keep pace.

Ummmm, ok, what was the ruling on the Deathray thing?  Cuz I read Dakka too, it's my opinion that a certain group of people are deliberately misreading things to get a more favorable result.

After this conga line fiasco, I sorta fear the answer, now.

Daemon Princes are Daemons, guys!

[Loranus]

In short how Sam ruled it number of models under line number of hits unit takes. So line touches 2 models in a unit that unit takes 2 hits.

[Benjamin]

Sam's ruling with explanation on the Death Ray thing:

http://www.battlegroundgames.com/forum/index.php?topic=2135.msg32473#msg32473