[Plainville MA] Battleground 40k Doubles Tournament - 12/3

[Bill]

I just want to say. I am Ben's biggest fan and I am going to give him a giant hug on Saturday.

[Sam]

Ben just let me know about this discussion. Since everybody's waiting on my answer, I'll chime in.

As written, "a Conoptek Spyder that is not locked in close combat can expend energy to create a Canoptek Scarab swarm". Note that the rules says Spyder, and not Spyder unit. As a result, I can't declare that scarab creations happen simultaneously without changing the rules.

Until we get an official FAQ, the conga line is legal.

I heartily encourage people to bring iPods loaded with conga music to play each and every time someone uses this tactic.

[keithb]

Sounds great sam.  

Also, you weren't just being asked how you read the rule but also if it should be legal.

You've played 40k, does a 50" assault seem like it was designed to happen, or just stupid oversight?

[Torvald]

Yes, please b ring your conga line into assault with my Dark Eldar. Please? Pretty Please?

[Frosthydra]

Or to the Tyranids... scarabs are crunchy.

[keithb]

Yeah... raiders and venoms who haven't moved yet hold up really well to scarabs....


This isn't about which armies aren't hurt as bad as others either.

[Frosthydra]

Oh I know, stretching 50" across the table is pretty absurd for anyone.

And obviously you can build with that in mind, but yeah, still kind of crazy.

If it happens, cool, I'll try to deal with it.  If not, at least we've all discussed it in advance.

[Sir_Prometheus]

For the record, I'm not that worried about this personally, but this still makes me sad.  It just shouldn't be legal, obviously was not meant to be legal, breaks some core concepts of the games' design, etc.

[Seth]

In apocalypse did entropic strike just nullify eldar holofields. They are tanks with a save that only triggers once hit. So a regular model loses a point of armour if unsaved and a tank loses armour if hit what happens to tanks with saves once hit. by rules they get no saves but that save would make it so that the hit didn't really happen. it just doesn't seem right.

[Sir_Prometheus]

Apocalypse isn't even meant to be balanced. 

[Ian Mulligan]

Sounds great sam.  

Also, you weren't just being asked how you read the rule but also if it should be legal.

You've played 40k, does a 50" assault seem like it was designed to happen, or just stupid oversight?

Sam is the TO and I'm sure hes read the thread. He's a really smart dude and wouldn't randomly come to his conclusion. I'm sure that's how he landed the TO spot in the first place. Rather than see this thread degenerate into trying to change his mind, it would be better to accept what the organizer has decided and move on. If it happens, it happens.

[Seth]

why is it not meant to be balanced? i don't think it was designed to be unbalanced. the core of it is based on the regular 40k rules so if that were true, then it would be safe to assume 40k wasn't meant to be balanced.

[Seth]

Well what about dark eldar flickerfield. how does it work against that. seems to me that the tank should still get the inv. save.(all this should be moved to the necrons thread also)

[Chase]

If it offers any sort of "good feeling" I don't foresee this being an issue on Saturday.

The rule / situation will be addressed more appropriately going forward, however (as it is likely it will be covered in the next INAT update).

[Loranus]

Entropic Strike just removes the Armour save from an Unsaved wound on A model so if you have a Save that wouldn't be an Armour Save (Cover, Invulnerable) Entropic Strike would not get rid of it and its only on that model if you have a squad of Multi-wound Models they all do not lose their armor saves if one suffers and Unsaved wound.

How Entropic Strike is Resolved against Infantry:
1. Roll To Hit
2. Roll To Wound
3. Armour Save if Applicable
4. Wound Inflicted on model that model Loses Armour save for rest of game

Against Vehicles:
1. Roll to Hit
2. Roll D6 for Each hit caused by Entropic Strike on a 4+ the armour on every side is reduced by 1 before penetrating rolls
3. Roll Penetration if Vehicle Still Standing

The reason for Entropic Strike is to roll those 4+ to wreck vehicles

As for the Scarab conga line I dont buy it as a viable strategy and costs way too many points I think to be viable in this tournament. 300 points by the way it sounds to get 6 Spyders and thats taking up 2 Heavy Support slots to do it which is a lot of points for stuff that can't do much unless you upgrade them more which then makes it 450 points to make 2 viable squads that pump out a conga line that loses the viability of having 3 squads. You play Smart if someone brings it Go second and deploy away from the scarabs with the weapons that can instant kill the scarab squad. (thunderfire cannon go :O)

The Conga Line is Defeated anyways by Scenario 3 since Dawn of War is so much Fun.

Dawn of War you move your models onto the board during the first turn during movement phase so you can not scarab hive that turn.

I think it won't be so much of an issue if people get it to work I think it will be great but I don't think it will win the Tourney for teams.