Scouts or Motorcycles

[Loranus]

I was considering instead of running a Scout Squad of 5 with Sniper rifles and Camo Cloaks that using a Space Marine Captain on a Bike and Forgefather Vul'Kan Hestan I could run a 5 Man bike Squad with the Sergeant, 2 Regular Bikes, A bike with a Meltagun, and Attack Bike with Multi-melta. The point difference being 90 for the scouts and 175 for the bike squad. I would like some Honest opinions about the matter.

[Duke]

haha i dont post on here much but i had to for this one...
A fellow player and I were just talking about this last week...
I have a full ravenwing army loaded with melta and flamer... swap out master of the ravenwing for vulkan and a captain on a bike... and i believe you have a pretty effective combo... (Scoring T5 bikes with TL meltas or flamers)

[Logan007]

In my experience, I don't feel that scouts (with camo cloaks and sniper rifles), being BS 3, contribute enough to be worth it if they're only going to defend a position and take pot shots (as opposed to say, a tactical squad).

If you're going to take a captain on a bike, I think it's absolutely a good idea to have a bike squad with the loadout you mentioned (bike squads can have 2 special weapons though, no reason for you not to have 2 in your squad) since they're now scoring.

They're less than double the cost of the scout snipers, but quadruple the value.

[Loranus]

Oh Wow I didn't even notice that 2 Bikes could take Special Weapons Thinking that way I could probably add the Flamer which will be TL for when It would hit more than the Twin Linked Bolter on the bike for the same Strength and an Automatic hit.

Ya I noticed that about the scouts for a 5 man squad you get 4 shots that hit on a 4+ one that hits on a 3+ then even after that no matter the toughness of the Enemy you need to roll 4+ with an AP 6 weapon.

[Benjamin]

They're apples and oranges. What's the rest of your list you're considering?

[Loranus]

Space Marine Captain
Vulkan He'stan

Pred And Vindicator (Maybe 2 Predators)

Assault Terminatours in a Land Raider Redeemer
Ven Dreadnought Assault Cannon

Attack Bike Squad

2 Ten man Tac Squads with meltas in Rhinos

Im just messing around with the last of the points in ideas atm. In honesty It was coming down to putting my Points into another Scoring unit that packed a little oomph.

[Ed]

vulken is wasted with scouts ,scouts suck
you need to make up for giving up combat tactics, cause its an amazing special.
add more meltas dread should have mutimelta and heavy flamer

bikes are Ok they can be fun

[Rurouni Benshin]

In my experience with using Bike armies, the Bike Squads themselves work best as a Shooting unit.  Like Logan007 said, Bike Squads are allowed up to 2 Special weapons, and the Sgt can take a Combi-weapon of the same type as well.  With a Captain on a Bike, they're great at moving far lengths to claim uncontested objectives mid to late game.

Scouts (IMO) are best when taken in larger quantities.  Typically, if/when I were to run Scouts, I'd run Scouts as my only Troop choice, and have the rest of the list work around them.  A single 5 man squad is likely to have a very low impact in the game, with the rest of your list being the way it is.

[Rob S]

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[the_trooper]

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[Imp]

i know i am a few editions out of date but you used to be able to have both....

scouts on bikes!

[Loranus]

From what I looked at the Codex Scouts Bike Squad are only really useful for the Astartes Grenade Launchers and Cluster Mines. The Grenade Launcher gives you Rapid fire Grenades which you can use as a blast at strength 3 and a strength 6 single target  and the Cluster Mines let you booby trap one Terrain on the board which is great except its so random on how well they can do in the game.

Unfortunately too you can not take Scout Bike Squads as a troop choice at all which this question was pushed at. I may proxy like 3 of  them sometime so nowhere in the game is safe .

[Rurouni Benshin]

From what I looked at the Codex Scouts Bike Squad are only really useful for the Astartes Grenade Launchers and Cluster Mines. The Grenade Launcher gives you Rapid fire Grenades which you can use as a blast at strength 3 and a strength 6 single target  and the Cluster Mines let you booby trap one Terrain on the board which is great except its so random on how well they can do in the game.

Unfortunately too you can not take Scout Bike Squads as a troop choice at all which this question was pushed at. I may proxy like 3 of  them sometime so nowhere in the game is safe .

They're also not bad if you want a cheaper and more survivable Locator Beacon.  Having them on the board to start, and going Flat Out during the Scout Move gives them a good chance to get in place for a Drop Pod to land on your first turn.  And by going Flat Out, if you have second turn, at least you have a 3+ Cover Save to hopefully keep them around until the start of your turn.  Just some food for thought...

[Benjamin]

Let's see, I've got a bit of time to break this down best I know how...

Space Marine Captain
Vulkan He'stan
Pred And Vindicator (Maybe 2 Predators)
Assault Terminatours in a Land Raider Redeemer
Ven Dreadnought Assault Cannon
Attack Bike Squad
2 Ten man Tac Squads with meltas in Rhinos

With what you have listed already, I'm calculating at least 1500-1700 points.

Vulkan lives with the Assault Terminators, and their Land Raider can move up, providing cover to following Rhinos.
The Vindicators and Ven Dread w/ ass. cannon can sit mid-field.
Predator sits in a corner.
The Attack bike squad lends support wherever needed.

I like Bikers, but I think there's a great argument for Scouts + something else with the points saved. The Scouts can hold an objective in the backfield and shoot at things. I figure with a small Scout squad you could squeeze in a second cheap Predator.

If you choose the bikers, at least consider giving them flamers. You have little in the way of anti-horde. If you load the bikers up with meltas, expect them to be targeted.

If decide to put the Ven Dread in a Drop Pod, then what Benshin said.

[Loranus]

I changed the list quite a bit around after doing some heavy reading that came about from me Getting Army Builder. Can't Change it anymore but I am very happy with the idea of it and hope it will do well. Ill be fielding it on Thursday to get the final kinks out practice-wise .