Quick question

[Chase]

Re: Doubles

We do not allow any interaction between teammates.  No sharing a transport, no IC's joining your partners units, no sharing of "effects" and "buffs", nothing like that.  For all intents and purposes they are two separate armies sharing the same force org.

What about debuffs?  How have we played them in the past?

Ex.  a Farseer "Dooms" an enemy unit which allows people who shoot it to reroll misses. The two armies are still separate but the common enemy has a debuff. Can both armies benefit from the enemy debuff?

I believe the answer to this is, "Yes."  How have we played things like this in the past?

[jhobin]

By adepticon rules yes as long as the wording of the rule permits that i.e. doom

[Dissimulation]

I think that if you should let both armies use the debuff. If both didn't get to use the debuff it's basically like cutting its effectiveness in half. However, you would disallow anyone sharing debuffs like the markerlights which are specifically used for buffing tau units only. (and vespid with strain leader )

[Captain Bryan!]

this also makes me wonder about ork bomb squigs, they can explode on the nearest friendly vehicle on a roll of a 1

[Grimwulfe]

Diss,

Yes only Tau would be able to use there Markerlight bonuses.

Bryan,

Yes the squig will go after a team mates vehicle if it is closest because it is friendly

[Chase]

This question should NOT be confused in any respect.  We are talking about debuffs only.  Stuff that effects and remains on the enemy like "Doom".


The words "friendly" "allied" or anything like that pertain to your army only.  Your 1250 points functions as if it were the only army on the table.

If an enemy unit has some sort of debuff on it (like Doom) and an enemy interacts with that unit, has it gained a benefit from the debuff in the past?

[Chase]

Bryan,

Yes the squig will go after a team mates vehicle if it is closest because it is friendly

This is not the case.  Friendly, allied, etc. do not extend to your partners.  I don't know how much more clear I can be about this.  Allowing this to happen would be the same as allowing Vulcan to twin-link your partners flamers or whatever he does.

Again:  Your armies stuff ONLY interacts with itself.  Nothing is shared, nothing is friendly, nothing is allied.  You can not interact with your partners stuff at all.

4. Teams are not integrated.  You may not share tech (for example, using each others teleport homers, etc).

5. If a unit/wargear/ability says something to the effect of "choose a friendly unit/model" you may not select a teammates unit.

I have never heard of Markerlights.


I am only interested in how we have played debuffs like Doom in the past.  I am not looking to change anything.  I was only looking for confirmation before getting back to someone.  Consistency is important and I want to be consistent.


.

[jhobin]

Never heard of Markerlights!

My Tau heart just skipped a beat. It has be the freak'in greatest thing in the Tau codex!

[Grimwulfe]

If I am understanding you correctly Chase and I was wrong in my above assessment then I would say no to your question.  My reasons being this -

1. the Doom spell was cast by an eldar to give eldar the advantage.  With your thinking above why should this advantage pass on to the second army?  Its a debuff designed to give the casting army an advantage.

2. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander - what I mean by this is that if your not going to allow it for 1 thing then dont allow it for anything period.  When you get into saying this is not allowed because and this is because... It will become an issue.

[jhobin]

I say for simplities sake you stilck with what you said on;

4. Teams are not integrated.  You may not share tech (for example, using each others teleport homers, etc).

5. If a unit/wargear/ability says something to the effect of "choose a friendly unit/model" you may not select a teammates unit.

So best thing to do would probably say going forward all spells and special rules only afftect the army casting it, period, no exceptions. That prevents vulkan/sisters tervigons casting FNP on its partners bugs, etc.

[keithb]

I say for simplities sake you stilck with what you said on;

4. Teams are not integrated.  You may not share tech (for example, using each others teleport homers, etc).

5. If a unit/wargear/ability says something to the effect of "choose a friendly unit/model" you may not select a teammates unit.

So best thing to do would probably say going forward all spells and special rules only afftect the army casting it, period, no exceptions. That prevents vulkan/sisters tervigons casting FNP on its partners bugs, etc.

this is all already the case.   Anything that TARGETS an enemy unit should work AS IS.

EX.  My hive tyrant uses paryoxym on a unit of Thunderwolf Cav, which reduces their BS and WS to 1.  THIS ALTER'S THAT UNITS STAT LINE.   It has 0% to do with what is friendly to me.  IF my partner's unit assaults this unit, their WS should not be restored to it's normal value because my teamate's unit is fighting it.  I debuffed them.  That is a universal effect, it doesn't matter who they are trying to shoot at, they are still BS 1.

EX #2.   Doom states.  ALL HITS CAUSED UPON THIS UNIT GAIN THE REROLL TO WOUND ABILITY.  It doesn't state anything about friendly troops, or anything like that.   If your unit is doomed and a vehicle blows up nearby and does some str 3 hits on the unit, THEY WOULD REROLL.   It is not relevant how the tank blew up, or who shot it.  Doom does not specify the source of the hits.

[Chase]

I agree with what Keith is saying here.

We are going to play it (and I think we have played it) such that "debuffs" apply where-ever applicable.

I see it as a positive side effect of team / list composition.  For reasons that I will not get into I see this in a very different way than I see allowing partners lists to interact.

The trump card though:  I am positive we have not denied this type of thing in the past.  See Keith's first example.