Quick questions...

[Serring]

Check FAQ of Space Marines, it is large blast.

[Chase]

Dan, we know that.  The debate is about the BA Vindicator, its printed rules, and what they actually mean.

[Serring]

This is for that vindicator argument:

page 35 and page 60 Blood Angel codex
35: vindicator. Tank fast. Bs:4 F:13 S:11 R:10
60: Demolisher cannon, Range:24" S:10 Ap:2 type: ordnance 1

page 80 Space marine codex
80: vindicator Tank  Bs:4 F:13 S:11 R:10
80: Demolisher cannon, Range:24" S:10 Ap:2 type: ordnance 1.     It's the same

page 48 and 49 Guard codex
48: Leman Russ Demolisher, Bs:3 F:14 S:13 R:11 tank
49: Demolisher siege cannon, Range:24" S:10 Ap:2 type: ordnance 1 large blast

page 58 of the rulebook
58, ordnance weapons: "Firing a massive ordnance weapon requires the attention of all the gunners of the vehicle, so no other weapons may be fired that turn (not even defensive weapons!). In return they are better at penetrating armour (see page 60). Unless their profile specifies otherwise, all ordnance blast weapons use the large blast marker.

So both vindicators do not use the blast at all.

Chase, I was replying to this.

[Logan007]

This is for that vindicator argument:

page 35 and page 60 Blood Angel codex
35: vindicator. Tank fast. Bs:4 F:13 S:11 R:10
60: Demolisher cannon, Range:24" S:10 Ap:2 type: ordnance 1

page 80 Space marine codex
80: vindicator Tank  Bs:4 F:13 S:11 R:10
80: Demolisher cannon, Range:24" S:10 Ap:2 type: ordnance 1.     It's the same

page 48 and 49 Guard codex
48: Leman Russ Demolisher, Bs:3 F:14 S:13 R:11 tank
49: Demolisher siege cannon, Range:24" S:10 Ap:2 type: ordnance 1 large blast

page 58 of the rulebook
58, ordnance weapons: "Firing a massive ordnance weapon requires the attention of all the gunners of the vehicle, so no other weapons may be fired that turn (not even defensive weapons!). In return they are better at penetrating armour (see page 60). Unless their profile specifies otherwise, all ordnance blast weapons use the large blast marker.

So both vindicators do not use the blast at all.

The Codex Space Marine FAQ erratas the demolisher cannon to be Ordnance 1, Large Blast.

[Moosifer]

So no more debate, until GW comes out with a BA FAQ, you are now shooting a super rail gun at people instead of a scattering piece of junk..

Bye Bye Land raider since with no template you have no scatter

[skavengear]

ive came to terms with the fact that i bought a vindicator for no reason. does anybody have a drop pod i can borrow the day of the doubles tournament since i now dont have enough to buy my own... ill pay some small cash ($5) for the rental and return it to you or chase at the end of the event. this would be appreciated since ive spent tons in one month making the army

[Chase]

Well I think it's pretty clear that it DOES fire the 5" template, but we are not playing it that way for the doubles.

We will play it that way for the 'Ard Boys Semis though.

[skavengear]

i dont need the vindi to wreck a vehicle, i have a secret weapon for that 

just need a drop pod rental from someone who pitys my poor noob self 

[Grand Master Steve]

Wow this is giving me a headache

[Logan007]

you can borrow a drop pod from me, don't worry about the 5 bucks.


I'll bring it the day of the tournament.

Also, a fast moving str 10 shot is nothing to sneeze at, you might want to give it a shot (pun intended) anyways.

[jesterofthedark]

lol, if you've read at least 2 pages of this thread your should have a migrane.

[Chase]

Steve, this is not your cup of tea.  Don't worry about it.

We've been over it 100 times.  The term that is defined is Ordnance.  Ordnance uses a large blast marker unless it specifies otherwise, like the Valk missile thing or the IG Tank Hunter Rich mentioned.


I said how it was going to be played before I was shown various things from various books and well before I understood that "Ordnance Blast" is not a heading defined by the rules.  We are going to stick with that ruling for the doubles.

[Moosifer]

Umm ordance for 40k has never been about the large blast template, but instead what sort of dice are used to determine the strength of the shot.

When you have an ord weapon that is NOT a blast weapon you have a strength + 2d6 pick highest die for armor pen resolution

Using the dictionary for 40k rules is a bad idea, as is using Forgeworld rules

[Chase]

Hey man, I'm just reading the rulebook.  /shrug

According to the Ordnance heading there doesn't appear to be an ordnance weapon that doesn't use a blast marker unless it specifically says the model does not, like the Valk missile and the Tank Hunter.

Why are people choosing to only take the first relevant sentence into account when determining what an Ordnance weapon means / is by default?

[Moosifer]

Hey man, I'm just reading the rulebook.  /shrug

According to the Ordnance heading there doesn't appear to be an ordnance weapon that doesn't use a blast marker unless it specifically says the model does not, like the Valk missile and the Tank Hunter.

Why are people choosing to only take the first relevant sentence into account when determining what an Ordnance weapon means / is by default?

If they are all large blasts, why is that not the default in the rulebook?

IG Deathstrike Missiles are a special munition, and in the codex it is pointed out.

Unless the words "Large Blast" are included in the entry, you cannot assume that a large blast template is used.

Do we need to bring in cyclone missile launchers from new marine codex to the old BA dex?