Megabattle 2010: What did you NOT like?

[Chase]

Kevin Nolzn had a great idea, so I'm using it.

I would like to use this thread as a place for people to post a list of stuff they DID NOT like about this years Megabattle.

Please post your comments in list format at some point in your post.  List anything you'd like...  Game play issues, the way it was handled, run, rules issues, rules changes (har har har), problems with the venue, food, special rules, terrain, objectives, scoring, whatever.

Personally, I would have liked the event to:


Start later and run later.
Have more space.
Not have the Doomsday Device activate turn one and blow up turn two.

[Rob S]

• Making Judgement on Rules

I figure I'd start with a big one.  Involving everybody in rulesmaking is nice, however it is not feasible to do efficiently in an event of such a large scale.  While posts can and should be made for people to voice their opinion on a certain rule decision that needs to be made, I am in full support of having a "panel" of the most experienced/fair players, led by Derek and Chase which discusses the rules.  Have players from either side to ensure fairness, but I would go so far to say that it is a necessity that as this annual game continues to grow a small group needs to be formed to make the decisions.

• Pre-Game Pep Talk

It's been on the boards, but I feel that the day of the game, the morning as everybody is sipping their coffee trying to understand why they're awake at such an ungodly hour, Derek needs to get up on a chair and give a talk to everyone that your entire army may die instantly.  This is Apocalypse, and it's even the extreme of that.  
I know that last year as my two reavers were assaulted by Forge World greater daemons and effectively removed from the game because they would become stuck in close combat, I was rather disappointed.  However I remember that it is a game where things like that will happen.  Tactics are often thrown out the window.  This year when Nick's Emperor was rendered useless on the one turn that it actually was able to fire everything it had because of Steve Riley's asset, I could tell he was disappointed but thankfully he kept his spirit up, even though he had spent months building it.
Apocalypse on this scale is different than everyone else.  You may lose everything on the board in one round of shooting and watch helplessly, but hopefully you can remain having fun.  I know people lose spirit after things like that happen, which is why I think a day-of talk would be useful to keep it fresh in people's memory, also to get people excited about the day that's about to unfold.

• Venue Choice

Hotel Steve D. was an excellent choice for this size battle.  If it expands, I'm assuming we'd move into the Grand Ballroom if we stayed here.  Hopefully an employee won't jump over Nick's titan and break off one of the castle turrets with his foot as he tries to get in a door without asking Nick to move it next time.


Finally, I did NOT like that there was no battlecry this year.

[General Leevous]

Personally I did not like the leader model. Fluff wise I thought it was stupid to have 30 of literally the same guy running around on the table just in different costumes. I was so opposed to this that I almost just put an icon of nurgler glued horizontally to a base just to spite people but I decided against it and wasn't a dick.

Idk that's just me and I don't think anyone even went for those models... that's just me though

[blantyr]

• I wanted my dice to roll better?  Is that one allowed?
• Not be opposite an Emperor or massed superheavy army.
• No effective 36 inch minimum range for the Emperor.
• More room is a good one, with adequate table space to muster and place casualties.
• I would have liked refills on the ice-water pitchers when they ran out mid afternoon.
• I disliked the mobile objective rule to the point I found myself ignoring the rule.  At one point in the battle I had a choice between using my mobile objective to defend the stationary objective, or to have him charge across the table towards the enemy Emperor titan with the sole motive of dying in no man's land.  It seemed so stupid and out of character to care where the model died that I defended the fixed objective.
  
  This of course likely cost Order the battle.
  
  There is a notion that Derek and Chase must create objectives as motivation for the two forces to fight one another.  I frankly doubt it.  Put the armies on opposite sides of the table and they will start fighting without artificial and unfluffy rules that make no sense.  I would like to experiment with far simpler and straight forward scoring next year.
• The Black Emperor was built in a week and looked like it was built in a week.  Solid attention to craftsmanship and allocation of adequate time by scratch builders would be appreciated.
• There were some very effective stratagems used by Disorder on the lunar table.  I know other players have grumbled about other stratagems and data sheets on other tables.  At some point we ought to start listing the possibly too powerful stratagems and data sheets and considering if they should be weakened or eliminated.  I'm not quite ready to start that process yet.
• In the weeks preceding the battle, Derek and Chase, rather than hold free and open discussions in which everyone participated, chose to consult with a very small select group of experienced players.  As the date of the next mega battle approaches and last minute decisions must be quickly made and shared, secret conspiracies by select groups might again become necessary.  Until time becomes short, I would far rather have the discussion remain free and open.

.

[The_Chef]

To be fair I have a widely known lack of patience and it's hit its limit.
People and their bitching about everything that annoys/may kill them or otherwise "isnt fair".

Secondly More room would have been nice.

Thirdly 8am is really really early for most of us. I certainly wouldnt mind 10-10. I dont know if this was venue enforced or just something the store came up with.

To be edited later if I'm told I sound too much like an asshat.

[Achillius]

Mostly Logistical, I ran into no rules issues during the game.

Timing was not quite what I expected. I don't mind starting at 8. But finishing at 8 was unexpected and disappointing.

Lunch... I know the idea was that we could all be more careful about lunch. But halfway through a shooting phase 1/2 the players disappeared leaving the other half stuck. That needs organizing better.

Players being spread out across the table. If you are going to spread out too far, then you MUST allow the people on that section to fight your models for you. I lost track of how many times I asked are we done yet and was told now, I'm waiting on player x....

Coffee ran out mid afternoon

A great day all in all.

Cheers,
Alan

[the_trooper]

Not a huge fan of the 8 am start (or getting called that people are bailing at 7:00am ).  10-10 sounds quite reasonable.

Not a fan of deli meat style but it's adequate (I'm in different but I also know the range of food is limited for such a venue so it's all good).

Agreed on the coffee bit.

Agreed on the water bit.

Not have Mike show up Thursday night to build an Emperor Friday .

Something learned from this year which I hope everyone does:  Clever use of stratagems can render any super heavy or big monster useless.

[Logan007]

• The Black Emperor was built in a week and looked like it was built in a week.  Solid attention to craftsmanship and allocation of adequate time by scratch builders would be appreciated.

.

You were just looking at him from the wrong side. If you looked at him from the side of chaos, for example, he looks much better.

Also, you fielded a Frisbee. Your argument is invalid.

Haha, just kidding. Don't worry, were I to field the Black Emperor again, he'll be much improved.

Bigger! Blacker! More Emperor!

Anyways, here's my list of things we could improve upon next year.
1.) The Superheavy arms race is a valid concern. although teamwork and solid strategy certainly helps, the team that fields more superheavies tend to have the advantage. Don't think about your ability to kill a superheavy. Think about the superheavy's ability to kill things compared to a mix of units that cost the same points. For example, when I found myself deployed across from this eldar player, and a Tau player, I pretty much (with not inconsiderable help from my teammates) wiped out their forces by turn 3.

It was really fun. I had a great time doing it. But it was also pretty broken. We should probably address this for next year's megabattle.

2.) We should definitely not think about limiting datasheets (titans are technically a datasheet, but for this discussion let's pretend they're separate). Even stratagems we should take great care in limiting. We had some epic level drama over the disruptor beacon stratagem, something that didn't have any affect on my table, and I would imagine was similarly impressive on the planet surface. Really, these things aren't as bad as you'd think. Not when your side can field a reaver titan.

3.) I think one reason the atmosphere was much better this year is because there was far less whining on either side the day of the event. We should make this a rule. NO WHINING.

[Achillius]

3.) I think one reason the atmosphere was much better this year is because there was far less whining on either side the day of the event. We should make this a rule. NO WHINING.

"Thou Shalt not Whine"   It works

[Lady GaGa]

The only thing i would like to see is a time limit for turns.  Atleast on the moon I seemed to be the only on trying to keep the game from stalling. 
Also I think that models that were hastily prepared should be left out as they take away from those who spend weeks and months working on some very good models such as Nick's titan.
Lastly I'm probably the only one who will take this stance but I love the 8-8 time schedual.

[blantyr]

• The Black Emperor was built in a week and looked like it was built in a week.  Solid attention to craftsmanship and allocation of adequate time by scratch builders would be appreciated.

.

You were just looking at him from the wrong side. If you looked at him from the side of chaos, for example, he looks much better.

Also, you fielded a Frisbee. Your argument is invalid.

Haha, just kidding. Don't worry, were I to field the Black Emperor again, he'll be much improved.

Bigger! Blacker! More Emperor!

Big Blackie definitely gives you a base to build on.  If you worked on him slow and steady over the course of a year, he could become almost sexy.   

Anyways, here's my list of things we could improve upon next year.
1.) The Superheavy arms race is a valid concern. although teamwork and solid strategy certainly helps, the team that fields more superheavies tend to have the advantage. Don't think about your ability to kill a superheavy. Think about the superheavy's ability to kill things compared to a mix of units that cost the same points. For example, when I found myself deployed across from this eldar player, and a Tau player, I pretty much (with not inconsiderable help from my teammates) wiped out their forces by turn 3.

It was really fun. I had a great time doing it. But it was also pretty broken. We should probably address this for next year's megabattle.

I did kind of notice your wiping out those Eldar and Tau players.  Glad to hear your evaluation.

[jfoodmaster]

I think that players who are spread way out should be constantly looking at their models to see where they are needed to roll dice. The guy playing Daemons on the planet table was MIA when I needed him to roll dice a lot.

Also, if people have to leave, I think they should probly pack up their stuff.

The guy that had the chaos emperor titan was suddenly playing the whole chaos side of the planet table in the last turn which I thought was weird, but no biggie.

Th last gripe I have is that I didn't have a Thunderhawk for my Marines. I'm gonna change that for nedt year.

I enjoyed myself very much and I love deli meat too, so it was good all around

[Rurouni Benshin]

All in all, I didn't have much of a problem with any of the rule changes.  I thought the way they were agreed on was fair, and the final call for all of the discrepancies behind each rule discussed was fair.  But I do agree with Rob, that something of a panel of players, headed by Chase and Derek would be inevitably necessary as the Megabattles in the future continue to grow on larger scales.

What I did not like:
 - Space was a little tighter than I would've imagined.  Having stayed at that hotel previously, and even attended events there, I was expecting us to have the Grand Ballroom, and I admit was a little upset that it wasn't there.  
 - Coffee and Water service could've been better as well.
 - Didn't hear about the guy stepping on Nick's Titan until the day after.  I propose that if the same guy is working during our next Megabattle, we keep him the hell out of the ballroom.
 - While this was irrelevant to the time we actually ended, because by this time, 2 out of the 5 Disorder players on my table had left, I would've liked to play longer.  

Otherwise, the venue was fine, the food was above average, and the atmosphere was pleasant.  Kudos to Hotel Steve D!

Things I did like:
 - 8:00 am start time (I'm 100% with Jake on this).  Seriously guys, it's one day out of a week when we have to wake up at a little earlier.  Most of us get up earlier during the week for work as it is; one more day out of the year isn't going to kill anyone. Stopping the game at 8:00 seemed a bit early, but it gave us a chance to get dinner and actually spend time together after the game while it was still relatively early in the night.  I had a lot of fun afterwards as well, and I'm sure that others would agree that the time we spent at Bertucci's that night was just as rewarding as playing in the Megabattle.

That's all for now!  I'll chime in again if I think of anything else!

[General Leevous]

8 to 8 start time was great in my oppinion. Id rather have time after to chill out and do stuff rather then stop late and going home and doing nothing. Its rough in the morning to wake up early, ill admit that. But later on it pays off.

[Serring]

The only part I kinda of disliked was not being able to take the emperor down but that was expected.
Also the way lunch was handle could have been better with each table taking a lunch break and not just wondering off to the food.
Was fun fighting the titan but I thing the Towering Monstrosity might need tweaking to make it more fair.